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I have MONEY

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I have MONEY

Post by The Lazy Rosarian on 15th July 2010, 06:20

Now that I have MOST people's attention. I again am pruning at our Mudgee Small Farm Field Days. We have a new Distsict Horticulturalist. She has been given the job to run the hort section. You say so what, in less than a months of talking to her (we) recieved funds to buy some PERMANENT roses. I have been doing this work for 11 years now with borrowed roses in pots/ branches of them. So in 2011 there is going to be ROSE PLANTS in the ground. What I need with an open mind from members. There is some limit on money. SO WHAT classes would plant as the people that come to the field days DO have a cross section of roses. I also will question the people that come over the 2 days. Answers will be given due consideration as time is on my side, Please give this some thought and PLEASE answer with some classes, Thank you in advance Regards David as always.
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Re: I have MONEY

Post by Guest on 15th July 2010, 12:46

Aus-breds! Modern, Riethmullers, Clarks.
I'm all for Teas, Tea-noisettes and Chinas but they're not much use at a pruning demo since they need little pruning... Or maybe you could use them to make the point that modern HT-type pruning is only for modern HTs, IF you're aiming for the show-bench AND/OR you have an English-style winter.

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Re: I have MONEY

Post by Admin on 15th July 2010, 17:06

I think Margaret's adivce here is spot on Thumbsup You could not expect better. There is a huge range of Aus-breds (I'll send you a book I have on Aus-bred roses to help you chase particular ones you like). If I can manage to get some of the cuttings of 'Australian Beauty' going I will donate one for your cause to do the climbing rose demonstrations Smile You would want to use a wide cross section of rose classes if you are doing pruning demonstrations so make sure your money stretches to buying/building supports for climbers etc... some of Gary's DIY plans would be great for field day demonstrations to also show people you can build great structures with non-fancy material that is a million times better than anything you can buy. How much space do yo uhave available? Some of the Alister Clark roses get huge.

Can I ask you something else Innocent Can we hand out Rose Talk paraphernalia at the field day so that people know where to come to join an online rose community for ongoing support?

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Re: I have MONEY

Post by Guest on 15th July 2010, 19:24

Umm. I asked Wal for cuttings of Aus Beauty too, for the Renmark Collection, and he said "I don't know why people would want to grow it - prone to black spot". Maybe settle for something less historic!

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Post by Admin on 15th July 2010, 20:47

LOL... he said the same to me but it was mildew instead Rolling Eyes

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Re: I have MONEY

Post by The Lazy Rosarian on 16th July 2010, 06:33

Can I have more suggestions from members please, 16 "lookers" yesterday(Thursday) not many replies, so can you contribute please.

Thank you Margaret for your contribution of six for thought, I will also "test" the people on some of those you mentioned to see if they know of them.

Simon I will take some pictures today and show "roughly" what area I/we can use. It might not be big enough for Gary's structures.
As for mentioning "Rosetalk Australia" it gets plugged every demo, some take it and may only look. This idea maybe to late this year, I will try and find a laptop and show people what is on there. This could be the way to encourage new members.

The main object from this point is to get "real" roses in the ground then expand bit by bit. As this is run as a field day I thought a cross section as the visitors to it have a diverse range of roses. It does not have a fulltime gardener, so I am going to "steptoe" all the add on infrastructure, irrigation, timer, mulch, fertilizer and anything else one can borrow(pinch). Even to the point of one exhibitor of roses to donate some and I will place a plaque with their name on it.
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Re: I have MONEY

Post by Dave on 16th July 2010, 06:54

Meilland's 'Maggie' is a bloom machine here, but needs a good prune each winter.
Austin's 'Graham Stuart Thomas' is a good one too for the same reasons,

Why don't you put in a Tea or two to show how little pruning they need!
Comtesse de Labarth and/or Mrs BR Cant for a bigger grower.

Congrats on the grant - and have fun!

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Post by Balinbear on 16th July 2010, 14:45

Read your post yeasterday but them had tofind out where Mudgee is. I'm not sure what normally grows well in your area but I would suggest a mix. Some small climbers, couple of Teas if you have the room and some smaller polyanthas for the edge.

If it was near my place I would suggest Pinkie (cause my wife loves it), Comtesse de Labarth and G.Nabonand (cause I love them) and Boarder for the edge (cause I don't think it gets the good press it deserves).

Throw in some purples and white perenials and you have a great disply.
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Post by wphvet on 16th July 2010, 14:55

David, my suggestions include Alister Clarke roses as well, specifically
Marjory Palmer and Mary Guthrie,,both strong pink,the latter being single,indestructible,can be chopped anyway and are low growing spreading shrubs.
Also love Sunlit,an apricot small hybrid tea with flowers in small multiples,disease free.
Continuing this theme of small floriferous and disease free floribunda/ shrubs include Gruss an aachen, lil marlene,,,the most vibrant red,and Bonica.
And as an aside a few rugosas,which while they are little pruned,they look great in a group and provide an interesting contrast to the above roses.Must haves include Fru Dagmar Hartopp, and the larger Scabrosa.
cheers

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Re: I have MONEY

Post by Balinbear on 16th July 2010, 15:44

Ah to live without humidity and Black Spot would be bliss.

Marjory Palmer and Mary Guthrie are both nice roses. We get a bit of BS on them. You could throw in several other of AC roses with some of his climbers if you have the room. Can't beat Squatters Dream and Lady Huntingfield if you want yellow.

Those above plus Ceccily Lascelles, Sunny South and Loraine Lee if you want pinks.

Daydream and Gwen Nash if you want a mix.

Black Boy and Restless if Reds are more your style.

We have all of these and apart for the Black Spot they are good roses.
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Post by Ozeboy on 17th July 2010, 09:44

David I know you have no Blackspot up there worth mentioning so would like to see an Australian HT collection. Bush and Climbing HT's bred by Aussies and not those come by chance sports from European roses.

Also a collection of Tea's, Noisettes and China's.

Save the money for Pergolas, Arches and seats with a good focal point.

I have a lot of baby HT's and Tea's I would donate because my Mother's family were graziers up there. Bill Cox was my first cousin and still have relatives there. My Mum and Dad were married in Mudgee and my sister christened there. I had a cattle property east of Mudgee so sometimes feel like a local.

Yep! I recon we should make it an Aussie Garden.

I have a lot of Aussies that are listed under Glenorie Roses on Help Me Find
and possibly 12 to list.

Regarding Australian Beauty, I am going to test it for myself.

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Re: I have MONEY

Post by Guest on 17th July 2010, 10:50

We're collecting Aus-bred polyanthas for Renmark; looks like we can get hold of most of those that are still around in major gardens, even if not in commerce, so eventually they'll be available more widely.
Riethmullers too, but it's disappointing that many have been lost. Carabella, Honeyflow, Gay Vista, Claret Cup, Titian, Spring Song are good floriferous roses and are still available. If anyone has any of the rarities, we'd love cuttings! Eg Esmeralda, Lady Woodward, others I don't know about.

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Post by Admin on 17th July 2010, 11:42

Margaret... have you got Mrs Alston's Rose? I can strike some of this when it gets larger.

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Re: I have MONEY

Post by Guest on 17th July 2010, 14:05

With the Clarks, we've mainly made it a token presence, because they're looked after elsewhere, and the big singles blow very quickly in Renmark's heat. Borderer is the token poly. So I'll hold off on Mrs Alston's rose for the time being, thanks.
It's complicated with some of the polys - where's the borderline with floribundas. Does anyone have Gordon Drake or Windlass?

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Re: I have MONEY

Post by Balinbear on 17th July 2010, 21:31

Margaret

You picked the good one to be the token poly. Its a great little rose and cuttings strike like a wharfie.

Gary
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Re: I have MONEY

Post by OzRose on 18th July 2010, 01:26

Been reading and thinking about this since yesterday and thinking about how I would go about choosing different types of rose plants for demonstration pruning.

To the greater part of the population , a rose is a rose . Most have thorns though some don't and some roses smell better than others ; and they do come in colours other than red when it's not Valentine's Day.
And they have all heard the bogey myths about roses being difficult to handle , tricky to grow and pruning is steeped in deep mystique .

I think I would start with what is available at the average garden center / nursery [and I'm not talking specialist rose nursery] or the local Bunning's store . [It would appear that they carry the same range Australia wide ]
[[And yes I can hear all your loud shrieks of **BORING** across the Nullabor lol! but to be quite honest , I think that someone who knows the difference between a David Austin and an Alistair Clarke is not going to be watching a pruning demo in the first place unless they want to have a chat with you afterwards .]]

I'm assuming that the roses are going to be planted in situ ? And where is the Field Day actually held ? who is going to look after and also see and enjoy the roses for the rest of the year ? It's okay to get excited about breeding or different quality of the flowers etc but if it's a Pruning Demo , done at Pruning Time a lot of that is going to be wasted on the public as most rose bushes are looking tatty and going dormant.

So, Classes of Roses .
[Deep breath here.]

Firstly some Hybrid Teas. They are what most non rosarians would recognise as a rose. For a pruning demo you want strong robust bushes that you can make decent chomps into and not too much piddly twiggy stuff to be wasting time on .
The Children's Rose [You must be registered and logged in to see this image.] and Best Friend[You must be registered and logged in to see this image.] are two good bushes to get stuck into.
Ignore the blue bale twine ; I had to pull the bush back up straight after one of the horses pulled it skew-whiff when they got their rug hooked up on it when walking through the garden.

Then some Floribundas . Again I would go for bushes that are going to give you some size to work with but can be dealt with , with a minimum of fuss . Sweet Sonata [You must be registered and logged in to see this image.] is a glorious rose and one of my favourite , easiest to prune bushes . [ It wont hurt your cred if you show you can do a pro job with minimal effort Laughing ] Apricot Nectar and Lili Marlene are also two floribundas that get a bit of size . And it doesn't hurt to have bushes that the punters can recognise the names ; they can think "I can do that ! "

A Climbing Rose or two. Perhaps an *Old* , [ Blackboy , New Dawn , Zepherine Drouhin etc ] and a *New* - Pierre de Ronsard perhaps or Altissimo or Golden Showers etc .
Climbing roses are one of the rose types that has a lot of people stumped when it comes to pruning and training them . Then you also get questions about how do you treat the once flowering types , eg Albertine [I love this rose to bits even if it's thorns want to tear one to bits ] or Mme Gregoire Staechelin . This can lead to an overlapping of subject with some of the O.G.R's and their management .

Look in most garden centers , and they'll have some standard roses included in their range .
Someone might ask for advice on how to treat their Icebergs or Seductions ,[ and not see the funny side if you tell them to rip 'em out ] I have even seen some very tall growing H.T's [ Mr Lincoln , Lady X , Queen Elizabeth] as standards for sale in Big W . Last year I saw some D.A's grown as standards for the first time . On another forum that I belong to , two roses that you can almost guarantee someone will ask about pruning each year are Renae and Crepuscule when they are grown as weeping standards .
I don't have many [about 5 at last count] but one of the easiest to prune is Minuette[You must be registered and logged in to see this image.] this one is a 3' patio standard and a lot of people grow them in large pots.

Miniatures and Patio Roses are other classes of roses that you will find in most garden centers and even in supermarkets from time to time. Quite often bought as gifts or impulse buys when they are flowering .
These can the be subdivided into cutting grown plants on own roots and ones grown on understock . I have several clumps of Softee growing on it's own roots, not the best pic I'm sorry [You must be registered and logged in to see this image.] but I prune it by cutting the whole mass [mess] off just above ground level and it does it a treat.

Mustn't forget D.A's "English Roses" , whether you want to class them by themselves or use them as an example of Modern Shrub Roses . Wonderful plants in the garden and actually a class of roses that I find flower very well if they are not pruned every year . They can attain majestic proportions too . Sweet Juliet here was planted in late 2004 and has been pruned a couple of times . I stuck my 5yr old in front of her yesterday to give some sense of scale ; he is 1.16m tall .[You must be registered and logged in to see this image.]

Sorry , did you say this was an hour long demo or a week ?? roflmao

What about the Groundcover Roses that you can prune with a chainsaw or the Species or or or ....

Better stop there , I have just seen the time !

Keep it simple and straight forward and use common roses that new / novice growers will recognise and be able to source without too much fuss . Once they have become hooked , well then there is a big wide rosie world out there for them to discover .

Cheers and Good Luck.
Rosalie.
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Re: I have MONEY

Post by The Lazy Rosarian on 18th July 2010, 08:54

This shot below is where the roses will be planted this time and as money or donations come along more will be added.
[You must be registered and logged in to see this link.]
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Re: I have MONEY

Post by The Lazy Rosarian on 18th July 2010, 09:41

[[And yes I can hear all your loud shrieks of **BORING** across the Nullabor but to be quite honest , I think that someone who knows the difference between a David Austin and an Alistair Clarke is not going to be watching a pruning demo in the first place unless they want to have a chat with you afterwards .]]
Rosalie, on this little bit, it is not formal, I treat as a very laid back affair. The people that come to see and talk roses are a verried lot. Som people that come are from the south coast of NSW, Sydney, Country NSW, and Mudgee it's self.
Subjects that were covered Friday/Sat
basic pruning and why, some got the chance when secuaters are handed to them

what has effected my rose bush(show & tell). what have you sprayed, grass in the rose garden, my answer R/up. and how to fix it.

I have just bought a house with roses in it, what do i do. I will come around next weekend and we will go through them.
what rose is this, send me pictures and my forum friends will try to ID it

Hello again David, how are things, this couple come to the field days every year from western NSW. They have 400 plus roses. They share their knowledge and learn some new things as we are a friendly bunch.

where do I buy from, how to care, water, feed, prune, how to take cuttings,seed. What sort of beds.

What sort of rose do I need for my style of garden

I have grown roses for 30 years, how do i rejuvinate my very old rose, was one from last year, Gentleman came back this year with cutting and gave it to me with thanks written on a card.

So basically what I am saying is we have cross section of rose growers from novice to show bench people

Thank for your post on this subject Rosalie, your post has given me some more food for thought, the more the merryer, we will be getting some new members also from the field days. All I am is the conduit passing on information and getting aswers from somewhere.
Everyone have a great day.


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Re: I have MONEY

Post by Guest on 18th July 2010, 15:52

There are Aus-bred HTs, floribundas, shrubs, minis, groundcovers, standards, climbers... See Ross's catalogue for examples. More elsewhere. There are plenty of people "dumbing down" rose selection - TV and magazines! - I'd be more inclined to let the field days be a chance for participants to go away talking about new ideas.
Interesting that sales of standards and Austins have fallen right off in SA. Changing fashions.

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Post by Ozeboy on 18th July 2010, 20:10

Margaret I budded Titian middle of last season thanks to Patricia so should be able to help with that one on your list.

Sorry, can't help with the others despite having about 30 Aussie HT's


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Post by Guest on 18th July 2010, 21:15

Titian we have, thanks. It was highly-regarded OS and is still fairly easy to find.

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Post by Admin on 18th July 2010, 21:20

Field days are an excellent opportunity to educate people that there are other ways of doing things too... in much the same way as this forum is a conduit through which to manifest change. The dumbing down of rose selection is something happening all over the world and this will ultimately end up with roses falling from favour completely unless people, who are more proactive, help to raise the awareness of people everywhere. I would be proud to be labelled a rose activist actually. In a time when we should be treading more lightly on the planet people need to be aware that there are other rose options that do not require pampering nor chemical intervention to survive and look great. People need to know that there are roses that can benefit urban and rural ecosystems in much the same way as native plants do and people should be more aware of their heritage and know that roses play an important role in Australia's past. Knowing there are Australian bred roses to fit every need and category is a great way to do this. For those who think a rose is a rose is a rose, a gentle 'Did you know this one was actually bred in Australia?" might be all one needs to pique their curiosity. Likewise a gentle 'Whilst we prune this rose every year, see that one over there? It never gets pruned' might make a big impact especially if they see a fully leafed up and flowering shrub in the middle of winter next to a bunch of bare sticks. I don't support the idea of using everyday roses for this because IMO they represent something that is no longer appropriate for gardens anywhere. It also helps perpetuate this monopoly on choice the big chain stores have and the dumbing down of expectations. All the questions asked of you Dave are typical questions and not one of these can't be answered within an Australian context and IMO an opportunity lost is an opportunity wasted.

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Re: I have MONEY

Post by Ozeboy on 19th July 2010, 16:50

I have 'Titian' courtesy of Patricia and 30 other Aussie HT's .

Would be willing to donate with great pleasure for an Australian Garden.

We must keep the dream alive.

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Post by Ozeboy on 27th August 2010, 14:26

Looks like the money has run out. Get the council involved and get the whole thing moving.

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Post by The Lazy Rosarian on 28th August 2010, 08:38

Bruce the council is not involved as the site is called AREC (Australian Rural Education Centre), basicly run by the Dept of Ag and the company AREC. If it had not been for the new girl at the Dept the rose would not be coming, most of the displays are by the exhibitors and maintained by them. Arec only looks after the hardware, IE buildings and roads.
I am going to Victoria on the 24th of September for 2 weeks and picking up the roses then nd returning them to my place to nerture them till winter when they will have their permanent home with all the goodies they need.
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