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Is there a striped class in rose exhibition?

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Is there a striped class in rose exhibition?

Post by Admin on 21st June 2010, 20:34

When you exhibit blooms, is there a striped class or do they all compete together?

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Re: Is there a striped class in rose exhibition?

Post by The Lazy Rosarian on 22nd June 2010, 05:45

Simon they go into a class called "anyother colour". It is like if you show birds and some other animals.
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Re: Is there a striped class in rose exhibition?

Post by The Estate on 22nd June 2010, 08:22

Yes it is called striped roses with the VRS, I have entered this class, novice section of course , in the past. I got a 2nd Very Happy
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Re: Is there a striped class in rose exhibition?

Post by Admin on 22nd June 2010, 16:02

I'm not into this whole showing thing but I am curious as to how it works and have a striped seedling I'd like to enter in the Launie rose show (see calender) in October.

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Re: Is there a striped class in rose exhibition?

Post by Ozrosarian on 22nd June 2010, 16:11

Simon wrote:I'm not into this whole showing thing but I am curious as to how it works and have a striped seedling I'd like to enter in the Launie rose show (see calender) in October.

Simon, which rose have you used as a striped parent?
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Re: Is there a striped class in rose exhibition?

Post by Admin on 22nd June 2010, 16:21

'Papageno'... it's a wonderful rose here... You can use most thngs descended from 'Ferdinand Pichard'. 'Papageno' is a striped rose with 'Stars n Stripes' in its pedigree (which got its stripes from FP). I've often thought about going right back to FP but decided against it at this point. Instead I went for 'Honorine de Brabant' which, depsite not descending from FP, has also been shown to pass on stripes. I've got OP HdB seeds in the fridge now to test germinability. I can thoroughly recommend 'Papageno', however, as its seeds germinate like weeds after a relatively short period in the fridge, and the resulting seedlings showed an enormous amount of variation from non-striped single coloured roses (mostly hot pinks and reds) to bicolours, stripes and bicolour stripes. The rose I'd like to exhibit is a bicolour striped rose. It's white on the back of the petals and pinky/red striped on the top of the petals on an enormous flower of excellent form. It's an HT and I don't like most HT but when testing germinability of OP HT seeds I don't think you can expect much else Smile This year I've crossed 'Papageno' with all kinds of things such as 'Tuscany Superb', the flower carpet roses, Abraham Darby, Comtesse de Labarthe, Lorraine Lee, Ebb Tide, Nahema, etc... I've got lots of seeds in the fridge from it now and am looking forward to the next few months as things start to germinate (already started.. got some very exciting babies up at the moment Smile ). 'Papageno' strikes very easily from cuttings and grows well on its own roots. If you'd like some cuttings PM me and send me your address and I'll get you some out over the next week or so (I'll send you out a plant of my multiflora hybrid as well while I'm at it).

This is the seedling I was talking about... OP 'Papageno'. Can you believe this was its first flower!!!

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Last edited by Simon on 22nd June 2010, 22:24; edited 2 times in total

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Re: Is there a striped class in rose exhibition?

Post by The Estate on 22nd June 2010, 20:12

WoW stunning Simon, a winners for sure, and as far as the Rose SHow here in Vic, I will not be entering again so many of the same faces and winners for my liking , I was a helper at the 2 previous shows and a lady who help with the judging in one section had an entry, hers got 1st place Twisted Evil That was the last draw, I was in one I was helping out on and rescued myself !! The two judging asked why , I simply said I had an entry in that section . Up till them I gave back any $$ I won as a donation, last show I took my $$ and was out of there , never to return.. BTW this is my opinion and nothing harsh about the VRS which I am still a member, and one of few paid up in advance !
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Re: Is there a striped class in rose exhibition?

Post by Ozrosarian on 22nd June 2010, 21:53

Thank you Simon. Looks very high pointed. Please post more images this year if you find some time. Also, any fragrance?
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Re: Is there a striped class in rose exhibition?

Post by Admin on 22nd June 2010, 22:11

Alas... it is scentless, nameless, and its future is uncertain... not even sure I'm going to keep it going Rolling Eyes The plant is strong enough... It's just I don't know if I can be bothered with it Dunno will keep it going for a few years, plant it in the ground, and forget it maybe and see if it turns out anywhere near as good as 'Papageno', which is one of my favourites here... great bush, very healthy... Not your average upright ugly HT.

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Re: Is there a striped class in rose exhibition?

Post by The Estate on 22nd June 2010, 23:27

In fact that it is pointed as it appears to be I think points are high in the judging area ? Am I wrong here ? when roses are being judged on display Rolling Eyes
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Re: Is there a striped class in rose exhibition?

Post by Admin on 22nd June 2010, 23:31

Dunno dunno... is all Greek to me...

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Re: Is there a striped class in rose exhibition?

Post by The Estate on 22nd June 2010, 23:41

prolly more like 'GeeK' Myth Busted!
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Re: Is there a striped class in rose exhibition?

Post by rosemeadow on 23rd June 2010, 00:00

Great photo Pose Petal. You had some tough competition.
Your rose looks great Simon. That reminds me about my one sole baby I pollinated of Kathryn Morely (seed)/ Fourtune's Double Yellow( pollen ). Its in a pot in a hole in the garden, where I had intended to plant quite some time ago. But the leaves got burnt and I thought I had lost it, though then it made a come back.
We have had such regular rainfall that I left the roses to look after themselves while I got back into my Kelpies, which I neglected quite alot over the last 10 years while having children and growing roses.

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Re: Is there a striped class in rose exhibition?

Post by Ozrosarian on 23rd June 2010, 11:52

Simon wrote:Alas... it is scentless, nameless, and its future is uncertain... not even sure I'm going to keep it going Rolling Eyes The plant is strong enough... It's just I don't know if I can be bothered with it Dunno will keep it going for a few years, plant it in the ground, and forget it maybe and see if it turns out anywhere near as good as 'Papageno', which is one of my favourites here... great bush, very healthy... Not your average upright ugly HT.

Why don't you try Papageno with some of the English roses?
I'm trying Scentimental with some English roses, to see where we can go. I've done some crosses and got seeds that are in the fridge now (I'm about to plant them), but this season I plan to do more.
David Austin hasn't released even a single striped rose so far. It would be quite a feat to create a striped but old-fashioned bloom with some of the heavenly scents of the English roses family. ... When was the last time we've seen an old-fashioned striped bloom anyway? 19th century? O boy, imagine a striped Golden Celebration or Munstead Wood?
People would kill for them.
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Re: Is there a striped class in rose exhibition?

Post by Admin on 23rd June 2010, 16:29

I'll leave the development of English style roses to others... my way lies with Teas/Noisettes/China/Wichurana/miniatures and work with species. My personal opinion is that, whilst beautiful, the majority of DA roses have limited appeal in an Australian context. To me it's kind of like trying to put a square peg in a round hole. I love the idea of putting Teas with DA roses to make Aussie Austins but not to make more of the same stuff we already have. The good thing about rose breeding is that we don't all have to have the same goals and this is what makes it such a rich thing. I love how you get that passionate and excited tone when you talk about the striped DA-style roses like you can visualise the finished product and almost smell it already... that's what drives us... we just each see a different thing... and I wish you all the very best of luck in chasing that dream down Thumbsup


Last edited by Simon on 23rd June 2010, 18:55; edited 1 time in total

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Re: Is there a striped class in rose exhibition?

Post by Ozrosarian on 23rd June 2010, 16:46

Simon wrote:I'll leave the development of English style roses to others... I love the idea of putting Teas with DA roses to make Aussie Austins but not to make more of the same stuff we already have.

I think that fully double roses from Europe have a mishap here, including Austins. They're okay, seldom great for this climate. Tassy and a colder part of Victoria are the only places in Australia where they can thrive. For this land, singles and semidoubles, noisettes, airy tea hybrids, hybrid musk and gigantea hybrids are, imho, the best.
Therefore Alister Clark was right from the beginning. Pity that we don't see many of the semidoubles and single roses DA has created during the last two decades. There are *plenty* of them, and NONE is available here .. ah, those pig-headed commercial importers and trial nurseries, that form our public taste and limit our choices >8@. They only import what they *think* it's gonna sell. And you end up in a vicious circle of limited choices that form more limited tastes.
So it's their fault, and people are thus used to imagine DA roses as huge doubles with full rosette shape, etc. But that's not true. I did find his Herbalist somewhere (God know when and how that one was imported, because to my knowledge it's available at only one nursery), and ancients like Dapple Dawn & Red Coat, if you're lucky to find them. And that's about it.
But look below at his Cariad, introduced this year! He has introduced 5 roses in 2010, and 2 are semidoubles. And there's no way in hell we can have them.

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Re: Is there a striped class in rose exhibition?

Post by The Estate on 23rd June 2010, 18:26

Red Intuition is a great rose, bush well have not made my mind up as yet, but for long lasting on the bush great and for cut flowers love them, I made this for a friends funeral a few months ago and yes all from the one bush Shocked

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Re: Is there a striped class in rose exhibition?

Post by Admin on 23rd June 2010, 19:20

I think it's also an evolution of ideas... semi doubles and singles are, to me, far more valuable in the landscape and allow the plant to invest more heavily in the production of flowers resulting in a greatrer overall impact. As more and more people swing away from roses (unfortunately this has to happen before any forward progress can be made IMO), more suitable roses can be produced. As far as the mass producers dictating the terms of rose fashion... that's why we need to support the smaller specialist rose nurseries and we need to support the recording and exchange of material among enthusiasts as we do here (this is the philosophy behind the rose traders database we have here). Even in Tassie some of the European style roses don't get enough chill hours to flower at their best. This is why I imported Rosa clinophylla seeds. It's a tropical rose known as the swamp rose. Paul Barden has already managed to get nice hybrids using clinopylla and combined with species such as wichurana, gigantea, bracteata, banksiae, roxburghii, and chinensis I think we can reinvent roses here in Australia, as Alister Clark began doing not so long ago. Species such as multiflora will also play a part but in a different way to the way it was traditionally used and species such as persica and rubiginosa will also have a bigger part to play. Rugosa are beautiful but I question how smart it is to use them for roses on mainland Australia... I'll keep using them for roses grown in Tassie as they are hard to beat down here. For me, the criteria is simple... a rose needs to grow well on its own roots (this almost always translates into easy propagation by cuttings... grafting should not be required and is an antiquated form of commercial propagation for all but specialist rose forms such as standards), grow without fuss and extensive soil preparation (despite conventional thinking being that this is good for the soil... it actually isn't. Mulching and other natural processes and products should be the only things added to soil IMO. The less the soil is disturbed the better it is), be able to grow without chemical intervention, have a long hassle-free life, and be useful in the landscape (ie shrubs of various dimensions... no more bare legs). Things like flower form, perfume, evergreen ability, full remontancy, etc are secondary to these other features. The trick is to breed what works in your area and to break the mould of conventional thinking that essentially results in breeders stirring the same old pot of genes that they've been stirring for the last few hundred years. It matters not to me that it might take more than my lifetime... I can always pass the baton on to someone else... so these are my underlying rose principles... a back-to-nature approach from this pantheist Smile

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Re: Is there a striped class in rose exhibition?

Post by The Estate on 23rd June 2010, 19:30

a rose needs to grow well on its own roots (this almost always translates into easy propagation by cuttings... grafting should not be required

100% here Simon, I would never be interested in what you all do , grafting ect... growing from seed until I was fully retired as it would need so much of my time to give my 100% to any project, I love my other plants that I can just break a bit off and way you go and usually better than the parent host as well ! cheers
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Re: Is there a striped class in rose exhibition?

Post by Ozeboy on 23rd June 2010, 21:26

I'm trying to breed away from them not to them. Golden Celebration couldn't handle the Aussie heat and humidity and just died. Of the 20 odd DA's I had here all except 2 have either died or were given awayas totally unsuitable for this climate. As I have mentioned before I will leave the banana growing to the Queenslanders and all those English roses to the Poms. The European roses to them for they are breeding the opposite to us. They want snow hardy and we want heat and humidity loving roses.

David Austin is to be admired for he has bred some of the most fantastic roses for his country men and Europe. I am still looking for one of his that will grow well here but unfortunatly can't find one.

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Re: Is there a striped class in rose exhibition?

Post by rosemeadow on 23rd June 2010, 23:14

Great reading your ideas here tonight. Ozrosarian, Cariad is very striking. A shame we won't get it. Petalplace, thats a super rose arrangement you did.

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Re: Is there a striped class in rose exhibition?

Post by Guest on 28th June 2010, 21:54

I would buy & grow 'Cariad' if I ever got the chance...very nice!!!

I am going to use 4 of David Austin's roses in my crosses this coming season.

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