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Crosses this year...

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Re: Crosses this year...

Post by Guest on 3rd January 2010, 23:47

I typed out a reply saying I thought you might have "Nearly Wild" already etc but it seems to have vanished into thin air (more likely I did something wrong haha).

I would like a "Nearly Wild" in creamy-yellow so I will throw some "Scouts Honor" pollen at it in the hope that just the colour transfers.

I know what you mean about "Temple Bells" & yes it was the exact same thing...wish it was always that easy.

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Re: Crosses this year...

Post by Guest on 3rd January 2010, 23:51

BTW it took a good 2-3 years for my "Nearly Wild" to take off. It sat around doing nothing/ very little but now it is unstoppable. This year it has flowered here non-stop since mid-October & atm it would have 200+ buds on it

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Re: Crosses this year...

Post by Admin on 3rd January 2010, 23:52

Have you got a photo of 'Scout's Honor'? It's not listed on HMF.

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Re: Crosses this year...

Post by Guest on 4th January 2010, 00:07

"Scouts Honor" (the yellow "Bonica" Wink):


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Re: Crosses this year...

Post by Alee on 6th January 2010, 16:48

My very first cross.

Don Juan x Jude the obsecure
Jude the obsecure x Don Juan

What are the observations made when you interchange the seed parent and pollen parent for the same cross.

Alee

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Re: Crosses this year...

Post by Admin on 6th January 2010, 17:04

Probably not much with this cross... with others in different classes, such as rugosa, there can be differences.

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Re: Crosses this year...

Post by Admin on 6th January 2010, 17:08

I take it none of the multiflora seeds germinated? Sad

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Re: Crosses this year...

Post by Alee on 6th January 2010, 20:40

Sad Yes.

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Re: Crosses this year...

Post by Guest on 26th January 2010, 16:50

G'day all!

I am just shy of 60 crosses now & only 3 have totally failed so far [Escapade X Papageno (3), Coral Meidiland X Teddy Bear (4) & New Dawn X Minijet(3)].

Most crosses have involved 3-6 (but sometimes up to 15) attempts & I am getting the hang of it now...shaking hands and all! LOL

I put some "Starlight Rose" pollen on "Nozomi" 2 days back & nearly went insane trying to prep the tiny Nozomi flowers & I nearly cried (not really) destroying "Dainty Bess" blooms for her pollen...such beauty in that rose!

Some more of my crosses are:

Jean Kenneally X Grimaldi & Papageno
Golden Holstein X In Appreciation & La Jago
Remember Me X About Face & Lavender Pinocchio
Roseromantic, New Dawn & Mrs Mary Thompson X Dainty Bess
Starlight Rose X Yellow Angel/Gelber Engel
Many Happy Returns X Parole, Nearly Wild & itself

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Re: Crosses this year...

Post by Admin on 26th January 2010, 17:38

I bought the 'Starlight Rose' today because it had a whole lot of large hips on it and some small buds forming... thinking about the best way to use it now... also got a climber the other day called Climbing Manita. It looks like it will be a good seed parent as well as it too had big hips on it. I've done near 150 crosses so far this year and almost every one on 'Scabrosa' and 'Ann Endt' failed... I reckon I'm batting about 50%... mostly because I'm using species and other wide crosses I think. Tea pollen has failed on almost everything. I've had Scabrosa pollen stick on 'Comtesse de Labarthe' though... I've stopped recording the crosses on the spreadsheet because I'm getting a lot of fails at the moment and am doing 10-20 new crosses each day and figured I'm just going to record the hips as they come in rather than every single cross... just more work/hassle than I need at the moment. 'Wild Rover' has proven to love almost every pollen I've put on it. I used 'Dainty Bess' as a seed parent the other day with 'Lorraine Lee'. Keeping my fingers crossed that one will take.


Last edited by Simon on 26th January 2010, 21:45; edited 1 time in total

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Re: Crosses this year...

Post by Guest on 26th January 2010, 17:59

"Starlight" is a nice little rose IMO & I have 3 big hips on "New Dawn" using its pollen as well as a dozen OP hips on "Starlight Rose" itself. I found that it did badly immediately after I bought it but it came good quickly & has stayed that way...I found this too with "Blue For You" & "Ebb Tide". Great then absolutely awful but then great ever since; maybe they are shaking off the chemicals & thriving when they can breathe again! Hahaha...

I hope to do about 100 crosses before mid-Feb (this being my first year) then around 250+ each & every year from now on. Nothing too grand but more than enough to keep me interested. I will always have lots of OP seed as well...

I put "Papageno" pollen on rugosa alba 3 weeks ago & the hips are swelling so I hope it worked!

I was thinking the other day that tea roses on "New Dawn" might be a good way to go considering the number of tea roses in "New Dawn's" background. There is probably some reason - I don't know of - as to why this wouldn't work though! LOL

As for wide crosses, the 14 crosses of "Nearly Wild" X R. setigera (done 4th of Jan) are holding on. Surely 1 or 2 will last the distance???

Just an aside, the 4 "Ann Endt" seedlings are doing great Simon, lots of new leaves & out in the sun with the big kids now!

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Re: Crosses this year...

Post by Admin on 26th January 2010, 21:59

I was thinking the other day that tea roses on "New Dawn" might be a good way to go considering the number of tea roses in "New Dawn's" background. There is probably some reason - I don't know of - as to why this wouldn't work though! LOL

I've been looking at this direction too and have been reading up on a rose called [You must be registered and logged in to see this link.] and thinking what a lovely looking rose it is and what a brilliant idea it is... I'll be putting an order in for 'New Dawn' myself this winter I think... just gotta find a virus free one Rolling Eyes I was thinking 'Comtesse de Labarthe' or 'Monsieur Tillier' x 'New Dawn'... both ways... or 'Safrano'... she's been good this year... got hips forming on her atm of 'Safrano' x 'Lady Huntingfield'... looking forward to these...

My 'Ebb Tide' had a teriible start to life! I received it from Treloars and placed in a bucket outside with water and seasol... left it over night and my dog decided it looking like a good toothpick and chewed it in half. I planted it down below the graft the next day and my big chickens and ducks decided to break-dance all over it and broke it again... there was just a single 5cm twig sticking up out of the ground... I put a cage around it and crossed my fingers and then spring came around and it began to shoot from below the ground... it's taken off now and is 2ft tall and wide easily and a mass of flowers... such a great rose in an awesome colour. If it can do well after that I want it in my breeding!

Excellent news about the 'Papageno' x rugosa 'alba'. Mr Moore made a very nice [You must be registered and logged in to see this link.] that I have been hoping to duplicate as well... 'Papageno' failed on 'Scabrosa' but it looks like 'Scabrosa' has taken on 'Papageno'

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Re: Crosses this year...

Post by Guest on 26th January 2010, 22:26

I think I have a virus-free plant of "New Dawn" Simon (never seen any signs of RMV in 4 years). It came from an old sheep farm out near Bigga NSW. Mine is a plant grown from a cutting from an old bush on its own roots so it should be OK. I can put cuttings of it in with your others later this year if you like?

Good on your "Ebb Tide" for overcoming the obstacles! Yikes! Two of my geese had a fight years back & snapped my plant of "April Hamer" (in full bloom at the time) below the graft right in front of me as I was admiring it...lucky for them I don't eat food with a face! Bwahahaha!!!

I will investigate "Tea Rambler"...

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Re: Crosses this year...

Post by Admin on 26th January 2010, 22:47

I'd forgotten about the other cuttings Damian!!! 'Teddy Bear' and 'Chameleon Rose' wasn't it??? When did we say you would post them? I better get off my bum and get ready for them Shocked

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Re: Crosses this year...

Post by Admin on 26th January 2010, 22:52

Has 'Chameleon Rose' ever set hips for you Damian?

FYI: The 'Starlight Rose' is an Australian Trade Mark name and not the original name of the rose. The registered name is 'Stardust'. See here: [You must be registered and logged in to see this link.]. It is classed as a patio rose.


Last edited by Simon on 26th January 2010, 23:11; edited 2 times in total

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Re: Crosses this year...

Post by Guest on 26th January 2010, 23:10

I was thinking I would post the cuttings off around May Simon...my plant of "Teddy Bear" is pregnant with "Wing Ding" & "Grimaldi" spawn atm (LOL) so I don't want to disturb it & "Chameleon" is recovering from yet another bout of BS (sure you want some of it?). I have never seen a hip on "Chameleon" & I haven't been able to get pollen from it either...no loss though IMHO!

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Re: Crosses this year...

Post by Admin on 26th January 2010, 23:15

'Chameleon Rose' is one of those memory association roses for me. My Grandmother grew the most amazing 'Chameleon Rose' plants in large pots covered 10cm deep in horse manure!!! She doesn't grow it any more as she has moved into a smaller house on a small block... so I really want it for sentimental/nostalgic reasons. It's also an Australian bred rose that I think needs preserving. It was once sold EVERYWHERE and now it's really hard to find.

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Re: Crosses this year...

Post by Guest on 26th January 2010, 23:22

I grow "Woburn Abbey" (Blerk) for the same reason...but not for much longer! It is catching the same bin out of here as "Peace" & its sports & "Fabulous"! LOL.

I see "Chameleon" a lot around here...it must just depend on distributors!?!

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Re: Crosses this year...

Post by Ozeboy on 27th January 2010, 07:56

Simon you mentioned breeding good breeders. That's the way I look at breeding poultry, some of the best breeders won't win a prize at the show but they will breed good breeders and show champions when used properly.

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Re: Crosses this year...

Post by Admin on 27th January 2010, 10:42

It's also the way I way I look at my rabbit breeding... your best show stock doesn't usually come from your best show animals... it comes down to lots of things like mothering ability, milk production, complementary traits etc... Ralph Moore made the amazing 0-47-19 (that's the code name for it) and this formed the basis of all minis. This was Rosa wichurana x 'Floradora' and it became his breeding workhorse. I, and lots of the older rabbit breeders, call the ability to recognise good breeders 'stockmanship'... it's knowing your stock and understanding that it comes down to more than just genes to make a good animal or plant.

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Re: Crosses this year...

Post by Alee on 27th January 2010, 14:25

Simon, could you please elaborate on how Ralph Moore used it. The basics of breeding is quite new to me.

Alee

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Re: Crosses this year...

Post by Admin on 27th January 2010, 15:19

Rather than repeating what others have written about '0-47-19' I'll refer you to an excellent link about it here: [You must be registered and logged in to see this link.]. This is an excellent article.

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Re: Crosses this year...

Post by Admin on 27th January 2010, 15:43

Damian.. check out this too: [You must be registered and logged in to see this link.]. Quite frankly I'm skeptical of the lineage of this rose... I find it hard to believe that a rose like this can be made in a single cross between wichurana and a Tea like 'Isabella Sprunt' (a sport of 'Safrano')... but I reckon it makes the cross with 'New Dawn' an even better idea. You know what ather rambler might work well with the Teas... 'Aviateur Blériot' ... it doesn't have many descendants list on HMF but you never know... it's the same kind of rose. It's also a first gen. cross with wichurana and an Tea-like rose (a Noisette)... Maybe a better way to go is to put a tea onto our "Temple Bells". So far "Temple Bells" has accepted every pollen I've put on it (even... and this is really exciting to me... 'the hybrid laevigata; 'Anemone'!!!) and it's a fully remontant wichurana hybrid ('Blushng Jewel' is the pollen parent of 'Temple Bells' and is a miniature so there is a good chance the first gen. would be climbing miniatures). I think I've actually already put 'Safrano' on it... will have to go and check... if I haven't I will... along with 'Comtesse de Labarthe'. Interesting huh. If you keep goping back through the lineage of "Temple Bells" you'll find there is even Noisette already in it and there is a good chance it is still diploid that will match with the Teas, which are also mostly diploid!

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Re: Crosses this year...

Post by Guest on 27th January 2010, 17:50

Hi Simon, I would believe the parentage of "Glenn Dale" (nice rose BTW) especially after discovering "Temple Bells" X MEIgurami made "White Meidiland"...it picked up great substance from somewhere! LOL

I think tea on "Temple Bells" could produce something really interesting. I have a great deal of trouble catching "Temple Bells" at the right time for pollination so have no crosses (as seed parent) with it yet. I have no tea roses now but I do have a few older hybrid teas so I might play a little & see what comes of it...

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Re: Crosses this year...

Post by Guest on 27th January 2010, 18:01

Hmmmmmmmm Idea

Dare I suggest "Centenaire de Lourdes" in the breeding of modern tea roses Simon? I am not sure if you know the rose personally, but it always reminds me of a beefed-up tea rose. Very healthy, it sets hips easily & it has "Mme de Tartas", "Devoniensis" & "Safrano" in its background.

"Centenaire de Lourdes" is also a parent of "Maggie"...an amazing rose IMO & also tea-like!

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Re: Crosses this year...

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