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Red Intuition... at last!

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Red Intuition... at last!

Post by IanM on 5th January 2011, 12:00

I have been a great admirer of the Delbard rose "Red Intuition" even before it was officially released. I first saw it growing as a trial plant at Brindabella rose gardens near Toowoomba, at which time there was some discussion that it may never be released. This was about 6-7 years ago. I can recall making many enquiries to the lovely staff at Brindabella who were equally frustrated that their hands were tied and although they had large stocks of the rose, they were not allowed to sell it.

I thought I could help to hasten its release by praising it on Dao's forum and I also contacted a Delbard company rep. down south. He informed me that it was still only a trial rose and no release was being planned. I persisted for a while, but eventually gave up hope. Someone who also had the rose as a trial plant must have felt sorry for me and gave me a couple of flowers to take home. So I got to admire it for a short while at least!

Later I found out it had been released down south, at least online, but not up here. I contacted the nursery down south who claimed that they had the "real" Red Intuition and the one stocked by Brindabella was an imposter! Shocked I did not believe this claim, but I wondered, why so much "cloak and dagger" carryings on over a rose??? Suspect

Then suddenly and miraculously Delbard officially released the rose a couple of years ago. I still maintain that the one they released is not quite the same nor as good as the original I saw at Brindabella all those years ago. I wonder if the one they have released now is actually a different though similar-looking rose, or perhaps a seedling bred off the original? Whatever the case it does not look quite the same rose to my eyes. There are still the black lines against the red, but they seem less clearly defined.

And I thought determining the "real" identity of Hume's Blush was confusing. Very Happy

Nevertheless the one being sold now as "Red Intuition" is still a spectacular rose. I look forward to seeing the first flowers on my plant.
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Re: Red Intuition... at last!

Post by Admin on 5th January 2011, 12:32

'Red Intuition' was a great plant for me in the first season. After that it all went pear shaped and 4 years later I now loath the rose and am tempted to shovel it every time I see it.

The first season it grew large and strong and flowered profusely. Towards the end of the season cracks began to appear as the flowers seemed to revert to a red and creamy pink striped rose instead of the red on red stripes that attracted me in the first place.

Then over winter it died back an enormous amount. Back to just a single cane actually. I cleaned the dead canes off and crossed my fingers and it threw a single strong shoot from the graft and I thought it was on the road to recovery. That's all it made the whole year. It flowered only spasmodically.

The next year I thought about the old saying about roses.. the first year they sleep, the second year they creep, and the third year they leap... hoping to see it leap... instead it limped... again... I left it and decided I was going to ignore it and if it died it died and if it didn't fine... was no skin off my nose.

This year it seemed to start Ok and still looks ok despite the downy mildew onslaught but is still a runty looking plant that is stingy with its flowers... I'm currently considering a few options such as grafting it onto multiflora, which seems to make roses perform much better here than the good doctor.

Two things struck me about it. The colour seems unstable down here. This suggests it is a sport of a non-striped rose or a differently coloured striped rose. Delbard's have never released the parents so my guess is that this is the case (though it seems to be their policy that they don't release the parentage of any of their new releases). The second is that it would be better as a greenhouse rose instead of a garden rose... it fails as a garden rose here. In fact, HMF lists it as a florist rose. Which ever way it goes, I'm over this rose and am just keeping it alive long enough for me to save enough cash to build my greenhouse so I can use it in cut flower production... if it reverts back to its first year performance. I've never sprayed it for anything but it is in a prime location and is mulched heavily with rotted animal manures too so it really has no excuses.

On another note, I have another theory... which I won't discuss online due to possible litigation.


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Re: Red Intuition... at last!

Post by IanM on 5th January 2011, 12:45

I will have to see how mine performs up here. It is interesting what you say, because as I was looking through the stock of Red Intuition to find a good one (not at Brindabella by the way, but another nursery) I noticed one of them had a really long shoot with a pink flower on the top!
I still maintain that the "Red Intuition" of today is not the same one I saw as a trial plant some 6-7 years ago.
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Re: Red Intuition... at last!

Post by IanM on 5th January 2011, 13:01

Registration name of Red Intuition is DELstriro. Discovered by Guy Delbard (France, 1999). Introduced in France by Delbard/Georges Delbard SA in 2004.

Delbards claim parentage of DELstriro as a sport of 'DELego'.

Reg. name DELego, Bred by Guy Delbard (France, 1996), commercial name Belle Rouge. A dark red Hybrid Tea.
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Re: Red Intuition... at last!

Post by Admin on 5th January 2011, 13:30

Ahhhhh... there you go Thumbsup suspicions confirmed!

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Re: Red Intuition... at last!

Post by The Lazy Rosarian on 5th January 2011, 17:20

Ian, I will ask the stupid questions in order as I see them
1. You saw a red rose around 6-7 years ago, Correct
2. Mr Brindabella had it, Correct
3. Released in the south by Delberds Australian agent online or other nursery, your answer here please .
4. Delbards release a rose a few down the track
5. Simon buys a red rose 4 years ago, not flash
6. Pink flower on top, "miss label"
7. Red rose "discovered" by Guy 1999
8. Afore mentioned red rose, "discovered" 1999, released 2004
9. Red rose(Delstriro) sport of (DELego)
10.Reg. name DELego, Bred by Guy Delbard (France, 1996), commercial name Belle Rouge. A dark red Hybrid Tea..
11. 1999(2004) red rose has to go through Quarrintine and build up stocks.
12. 1996 rose, same as above.
13. My question, then who was the importer of "discoverd"1999 rose and 1996 rose
So which one do you "think" you might have Simon.
Ian, IMO, I have doubts about some of the practices of some people, as Simon has mentioned, Litigation and things,
Thats all folks, IMO only and not that of this forum.

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Re: Red Intuition... at last!

Post by Admin on 5th January 2011, 17:27

I have the southern one. Without seeing the two I would be hesitant to say they were different... I just think there are 'other factors' involved here that are influecing its expression. On this.. I have my theories but won't discuss them here. Let's just say that I would like to get my hands on the Brindabella one to replace my southern one from a nursery that will remain nameless Wink

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Re: Red Intuition... at last!

Post by The Lazy Rosarian on 5th January 2011, 17:48

Always the "diplomat" Simon roflmao
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Re: Red Intuition... at last!

Post by The Lazy Rosarian on 5th January 2011, 17:51

Again another thought Ian, would you recognise it if you went back to Brindabella and it was growing, as I am not a "thief" but a cutting might fall into your pocket as to say.
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Re: Red Intuition... at last!

Post by Admin on 5th January 2011, 18:02

Brindabella are allowed to sell it now Wink

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Re: Red Intuition... at last!

Post by IanM on 5th January 2011, 18:47

I know, the dates just don't add up and I've puzzled over these things myself for some time but drawn a blank.

Problem is, how do we know Brindabella are not stocking the same one now as the southern one, if there ever was a southern one? lol!

I know from experience that nurseries are often notorious for claiming that they have the "one and only" true cultivar of something... I guess this is just "business", but sometimes it does contain a grain or two of truth. I know I have walked around many different nurseries and found plenty of mislabelled plants. But I should think that a Delbard rose will always be a Delbard rose, and any perceived variation must be to do with other things that I won't go into on this forum.

Suffice to say that for my money the Brindabella plants I saw around 6 years ago were so large and vigorous and healthy that I would be inclined to purchase Red Intuition from them. I bought mine from a general nursery in Toowoomba, so I have no idea of the origins of mine. It may have come from a more southern supplier. If it fails to live up to expectations I will go for a drive to Brindabella.

Anyway, will post up some photos when it blooms and provide some updates on growth etc.
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Re: Red Intuition... at last!

Post by The Lazy Rosarian on 6th January 2011, 06:28

Ian, if you are as up front with things as I am, I would just ask in general who the nursery gets there roses from. IMO
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Re: Red Intuition... at last!

Post by orchid40 on 10th January 2011, 13:27

I bought my Red Intuition from Bunnings. It was great for 3 years. This year it is just a bunch of sticks from Downey Mildew.

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Re: Red Intuition... at last!

Post by Happy roses on 27th January 2011, 11:21

I bought a red intuition from a rose nursery, and I rushed it home with excitment, planted it etc..One of the canes promptly died back. I had since transplanted it to a better spot and it was all right for a while and now one of the other canes is starting to die back with the result it looks like a sad little twig Sad I'm not sure whether to keep it so I started looking at forums to see if I could find out why. It appears that this only intended as a florist rose ( according to a rose forum titled - Dieback Issues with red intuition ) and was never intended for the garden. This was a couple of years ago so I guess they have released a garden version as that what was written on the tag on mine. So I'm not sure whether to keep it and I have only a couple of flowers off it so I really can't comment on the colour problems as mine didnt seem to bad...

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Re: Red Intuition... at last!

Post by The Estate on 29th January 2011, 08:58

I have two, one in the garden and one in a pot, the potted one seems to do better for some reason, bot in flower ATM Smile
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Re: Red Intuition... at last!

Post by Happy roses on 14th October 2011, 08:56

Hi

I recently bought another red intuition, this time it's in a pot and growing quite well, except the first bloom has opened and there is no stripes. It looks to be the same shape and base red otherwise. Is this normal for RI to do this? confused
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Re: Red Intuition... at last!

Post by Admin on 14th October 2011, 18:23

This is common for striped roses that are the result of sporting. The parentage of 'Red Intuition' shows it is a sport of a non-striped rose. Mine shows lots of variation too and I'm assuming it is a sport.


Last edited by Simon on 29th October 2011, 13:57; edited 2 times in total

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Re: Red Intuition... at last!

Post by Happy roses on 15th October 2011, 23:59

Hey thanks, thats interesting to know. I did speak to the nursery and they said the last couple they tagged as RI had turned out to be something else. They have offered to give me another one when they get more stock in. I'll keep an eye on it and see what happens anyway...
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Re: Red Intuition... at last!

Post by jeff koelewyn on 29th October 2011, 13:33

Interesting thread....another example of a rose being generically known by the trademark........this is not a criticism ...just a fact of life

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